Coming to the Hardcore scene in the late 90’s, All Out War was a force to be reckoned with that I couldn’t ignore. In an era when Victory Records could (almost) do no wrong, AOW’s landmark album For Those Who Were Crucified, stood at the top of its class. It provided heavy music for us to kill each other to and taught us the crucial life skill of having “no faith in the human race”. Luckily for us, they did not stop there and kept on delivering Metal to the Hardcore crowds ever since then, from the bone crushing Condemned to Suffer to their great new record Crawl Through the Filth. I spoke to their singer Mike Score this summer, before their show at Katacombes.
All Out War’s latest record, Crawl Among The Filth is available through Unbeaten Records. If you are lucky enough to be in the North East, catch them this weekend on a stacked line-up, along with Integrity and Enforced, with support from Apes in Quebec City and Maniac in Somerville, MA.
What have you been listening to the most lately?
I’ve been listening to the new DARKTHRONE record, which is fucking awesome. I’ve been listening to the new POSSESSED record, which is great. Let’s see, what else did I just buy? I’m a record guy so I buy music. I love buying music, I love vinyl records, so I buy a few records a week, probably more than I should. So I’m trying to think of everything that I bought…The new FULL OF HELL is fantastic. I mean, there’s so many things. The new ABBATH is great. I buy so much that I’m going through my head, what did I get recently? VENOM Welcome to hell came in the mail. Stuff I bought off of eBay. Just a tons of stuff. I mean, I’m always buying records. I don’t get out to as many shows as I would like, but I definitely support by buying records.
Do you typically listen first and then buy or it’s just, new record coming out, I’m getting it?
I’m a buyer, man. I love the surprise. I’m not one of these guys that streams the stuff first or whatever. I buy records. If it’s a band I like, I buy it. If I don’t like it? Well, it sits on the shelf. If I love it, I play it to death. Maybe it’s because I’m older but I never got the concept of like, “Okay, I’m gonna stream this song. Maybe I’m going to listen to the album. Maybe I’ll buy it.” I’m not that guy. I go out and I buy records all the time.
What’s your favorite way of discovering new music?
I have a go to record store that I go to, Rock Fantasy in Middletown, New York. I flip through and I just say “Hey Steve, what would I like, do you think?” He’s like, “if you’re into that, then you’ll like this” so I just kind of take his word for it and usually he’s right. That’s what I do.
You started off with Darkthrone, where you would you place it in their discography?
I think it holds up. I mean, I’m not one of these purists or haters. I’m not one of these guys, “their old stuff is better.” I dig it. I like it.
What are some of your favorites from them?
Northern Sky is probably my favorite record but the new one holds up so I’m into it.
What’s the record that you’ve listened to the most in your life?
In my life? That’s a great question. I’ve been saying this a lot lately, but it’s totally true, I love BOB DYLAN Desire. I love that record. I started listening to it when I was a little kid and still to this day, I listen to that record a lot. So that’s probably the record, I listened to the most of my life. When you’re counting the time I was little, because my dad turned me on to that. Until now, that’s the record. I know it’s not very Metal or not very Hardcore but that’s the record that I’ve listened to the most.
Which is great, actually. What we’re looking for in these interviews is whatever you really like, not necessarily Metal or Hardcore. It can go in any direction.
I mean, there’s so much. I like the CURE, you know? The CULT. FIELDS OF THE NEPHILIM is another band I listened to a lot.
You mentioned Dylan’s Desire and being a kid. Do you remember the first time that music had an impact on you?
It’s probably that record. I remember hearing The Hurricane and that song kind of really kick started me into my love of music. I mean, there’s nothing better than music. It’s one of those things where, as somebody who is sort of an introvert -and even though I sing for a band-, it always gave me a feeling of belonging. So whatever music it is, that’s what I do, man.
As a timeline of sort of your love of music or your evolution through music, could you go through five records that really had an impact on you, along the way.
From the BOB DYLAN Desire record, I go to Van HALEN 1984 to RATT Out of the Cellar to SLAYER Hell Awaits to VENOM Black Metal to AGNOSTIC FRONT Victim In Pain to CRO-MAGS Age of Quarrel. Now I start getting into the more Hardcore stuff so I started to branch into that a little bit deeper. The first SICK OF IT ALL record, Blood, Sweat and No Tears, and then UNDERDOG Vanishing Point came out, that was a great record. Then I started to move more into the NAUSEA stuff, Extinction. So now I started to get into the more Crusty stuff because that had the metallic edge and then I skipped and I had to go back to KREATOR Pleasure to Kill. And now, I’m back in my Hardcore phase but my love for the Metal stuff always would come back because I’m a metalhead at heart. I mean, you can hear it All Out War. I saw some kid, one of these young Hardcore kids and why they don’t like All Out War, and they’re like, “they’re too Metal.” It was supposed to be an insult but I loved it! I loved that kid saying that. Yeah dude, we’re total Metal! So I’m always going back to the Metal stuff. I like the Death Metal stuff but not as much as the Thrash stuff so i was happy to see the resurgence in that. I mean, there’s so many records, I could go on and on, especially with the Metal stuff.
Can you name three songs that you would consider perfect and say what makes them so special to you?
I would say CRO-MAGS’ We gotta know is a perfect song. It’s got that perfect mix of MOTÖRHEAD and BAD BRAINS to it. It’s got that intro, the lyrics are great. That pops into my head right away. Then, I would say VENOM’s Buried alive because it’s got the creepy voice in the beginning and it just creeped me out the first time I heard it. The Hurricane (Bob Dylan) would be another great one. Lyrically, it’s perfect. You know, social awareness, everything is great.
In terms of lyricist, do you have a favorite? Would that be Dylan?
Yeah, overall, it would probably be Dylan, for his whole body of work. Well thought out, eye opening songs with a purpose.
Is it head and shoulders above everyone else for you?
I mean, I like a lot of individual songs but I can’t pinpoint a writer. I always like songs that say something; those are my favorite songs. Besides, I like the over the top Metal stuff too, don’t get me wrong, but what brought me into Hardcore was I liked the lyrics. I liked the lyrics a lot more than Metal.
As far as Hardcore goes, what band do you think has the the best lyrics?
I think Richie Birkenhead from UNDERDOG had great lyrics. I think NAUSEA had great lyrics. AMEBIX had great lyrics. We can go on and on. SUBHUMANS. As far as crazy weird lyrics, Rennie from STARKWEATHER has great lyrics. If anybody’s never heard of them, check them out. Especially the first two records, Crossbearer and Into The Wire. Rennie’s got fantastic lyrics.
What’s the first thing that strikes you when you listen to new music? Is there anything that makes or breaks a band?
A lot of times, as with a lot of people I think, the vocalist can either really pull me in or kind of make me feel “Yeaaah, so-so”. I just really like music with a lot of emotion and just sheer aggressive stuff. Driving music that just blows you away. Chaotic fast. That’s the stuff I really dig.
What are some of the heaviest riffs ever, in your opinion?
SLAYER, Hell awaits, the beginning intro, hands down the best. As far as just straight up riffs, STARKWEATHER Murder in Technicolor has great riffs in that song. Here’s an obscure riff, that probably nobody’s heard of. There’s a band that Alan Blake, who was in SHEER TERROR, formed called DARKSIDE and the riff to Forgiven not forgotten is a great riff.
Do you have any more of these dark horses-type stuff that you love? It can be a band, an album or even a song buried at the end of an album and you think it’s the best thing they’ve put out.
You know, I always hear the great debate about Metalcore and who started it and it’s always revisionist history. Either kids that weren’t there and they always throw out these weird bands that came much later. The thing is, what was going on in New York in the early 90’s, there were so many bands that don’t get the credit they should get. CONFUSION from Brooklyn, SOCIAL DISORDER from Brooklyn. All those bands were riding the metallic edge and to me, I think the term Metalcore is so stupid nowadays because to me, if you’re a Metalcore band, you’re a band that appeals to real metalheads AND real hardcore people. What a lot of these kids say, well, that’s not appealing to metalheads. In my mind, when it was the earlier bands doing this, it was bands that really loved Thrash Metal and really loved Hardcore and they meshed it together. You went to their shows, and there were Hardcore kids there, there were long hair, metalheads there and that was what Metalcore was. Now, all these revisionist that are talking about bands that came came around in the late 90’s, come on! Bands have been doing that stuff since the mid 80’s. What are you talking about? You’re acting like this is some new thing. It’s been going on forever.
Yeah, they’re only talking about the era when the term became popular, and not the actual music that influenced it, like the D.R.I.’s and…
The first time that I saw the term Metalcore was actually in one of these magazines from the 80’s, like RIP, or one of them. They were talking about CRUMBSUCKERS and they said they were a Metalcore band. So like I said, it’s all revisionist history. You got all these people that say, “Oh, this is when the phrase came, and this is what…” Man, people have been using that word forever. It’s not a new thing.
What are some of the most memorable shows that you’ve seen?
The most memorable show, I was just talking about this the other day, NUCLEAR ASSAULT, BROKEN BONES and UK SUBS, I saw at City Gardens in New Jersey. That show was eye opening for me because it was a total mixed bill. You had Nuclear Assault coming from the thrash angle and then you had Broken Bones and UK Subs, total punk bands, on the same bill and that was awesome.
Then SICK OF IT ALL’s record release show for Blood, Sweat and No Tears at CBGB’s was another memorable show. When I saw JUDGE at the Anthrax in Connecticut that was another memorable, memorable show. Then, there was a place in Middletown, New York, which is around my area -I’m from outside of New York City, roughly like an hour north- and it’s a place, I’m not even bullshitting you, so small, from like where we’re sitting to the car (note: 15 feet tops) and I saw KREATOR there. They don’t even have a stage and this was when Kreator was much too big to play that room. They must have been bummed out to be there when they say it but we loved that place because it was a tiny, tiny place. We had Kreator and CORONER played there and BIOHAZARD played there and then UNDERDOG played there, then SEPULTURA played there. It’s this tiny hole in the wall and I’m sure that when these bands signed this contract to play there, they had no idea what it was. It wasn’t when these bands were starting out, they were already established and they’re showing up like…The Hardcore bands that played, they’re used to it, but I always wonder, what do these mid big Metal bands thinking when they show up to this place?
Is this the back room?
That’s what it was like! But it’s where they play. It was way smaller than Katacombes and no stage, bands played on the floor. I’m thinking that that owner must have just had a ton of money and he’d just throw these bands whatever they were asking for because there’s no way he could have broke even because it fit probably 100 people…illegally! So a lot of memorable shows came from that place. Then the obvious, like the famous places, like the Anthrax and CBGB’s and L’Amour and all those places there.
Do you have a favorite venue ever? Or it’s just all of these?
My top three favorite venues of all time was L’Amour in Brooklyn, CBGB’s and the Anthrax in Connecticut. Those are my top three favorite clubs that I’ve ever been to. Then there’s some clubs that just were cool because it’s some of the first places that went to, like City Gardens in New Jersey, which is famous place down there and this place called Streets which is in Westchester County, right outside of New York City, towards Yonkers’ side. Streets always had cool mixed bills, I like places like that. That’s why I really liked City Garden.
Is there any band that you’ve always wanted to see but missed out and never got to see them?
Yeah, I love CRUMBSUCKERS and I never saw them. I had two shots later to go and I didn’t go. I’m sad I missed them. Everybody else, I’ve mostly seen but for whatever reason, the stars in the line.
Do you have anyone on your bucket list right now that you’re you’re thinking, you must see?
Yes. I missed BELPHEGOR and I really want to see them. I missed them when they came through on the DARK FUNERAL tour that they were doing. I wish I would have saw that. A lot of the Black Metal stuff, there’s a lot of them that have rolled through. I did see MAYHEM, twice actually, so that was cool. I just started to kind of delve into Black Metal a little bit more in the last couple of years so I haven’t really seen a lot of them, except for the ones that All Out War played with on European festivals and those festival settings. I’d like to see them in more of a smaller club.
In terms of bands that you’ve toured with, what would be the band that was the the most impressive, the one that you had to watch their set night after night?
I would say CONGRESS from Belgium was incredible. We became really good friends with them and spent a month with them. To see them every night was awesome. Then, just recently, the small run we did with INTEGRITY, they were fantastic. It was only four nights, but they ripped every night. They were fucking awesome so it was great to see them. Let’s see, who else? There’s a lot of bands. SHADOWS FALL, we toured with them and they were great every night.
Do you typically watch a lot of the of the openers? A lot of the bands that you tour with?
On tours, yeah, we do. On shows like tonight, it’s really hard because there’s so many bands and after a while, it’s like overload. But on tours, yeah. TOXIC HOLOCAUST was another one. They ripped every night. They are great to watch.
As far as new bands go, on that INTEGRITY run we did, FUNERAL CHIC was amazing. They’re great, they’re from North Carolina, like POISON IDEA meets old COC type stuff, just dirty, ugly stuff, man. They were great. I was really glad to get the opportunity. These are bands that I was turned on to because we went on the road with them.
Did you actually discover them live?
What happened was, the tour got announced and then I checked them out. I loved them and then to see them live, it was great. Then, you go back to the old days, we used to play with BURIED ALIVE and REACH THE SKY all the time. On any given weekend, somewhere in the northeast, you could see some combination of those bands. I loved watching those bands every night. I loved doing that because there was All Out War, total Metal band, then there’s Buried Alive, you got the metallic Hardcore stuff going on and then Reach The Sky and they were like happy! It was great to be on the road with those two bands, we did countless tours with them.
There’s actually a classic show in Montreal, in ’99, which was supposed to be that bill but you didn’t make it. I mean, back then in Montreal, half of the bands didn’t make it at the border and we’d end up with a totally different bills.
I know exactly what happened! We got stuck at the same border we just came across. I mean, it’s so funny the difference. Now they just ask you a couple of questions. They might scold you and bring up “hey, we know that you got stopped at the border in 1999.” You think you’re not getting in and they’re like, “Okay, see you later.” and just let you go through. But back then, it was rolling the dice. Sometimes we got in, sometimes we didn’t!
But these days, you have contracts and all the paperwork, that helps! *Hahaha*
You know, back then, they would always give you a bullshit story to tell them. The show that you’re talking about, they told us to tell them that we were coming here to gamble! *Hahaha* We don’t know, so we go with it and they’re like, “really!?” and they make us show our wallets. Back then, nobody had any money so between us, we probably had like $30 and they were like, “you’re coming to gamble with $30, right?” Andy, our guitar player, was the only grown up at the time and he had a credit card so we said that we were all going to use his credit card! So they said to us, “okay, you can go, but you have to leave your musical equipment here.” That was the end of it! *Haha* That was one lie that they would tell us to use. Another lie was, we’re coming here to record and that lie hardly ever worked. You know, the only thing that ever worked is if you just got lucky. Now, they give us a whole manifest to get in and they just look at the paperwork. Sort of pretend to look at it.
Is there any classic or universally acclaimed artists that you didn’t like at first, but grew to love and became one of your favorites?
There’s a lot of those. Well, I didn’t like The CURE, The SMITHS, all that kind of stuff. Back when it was like the cool thing, I wasn’t into it all. Now it’s stuff I listened to to relax. It definitely has grown on me. I didn’t like the Black Metal at first, when it was first like popping in the 90’s and that all grew on me as time went on. I can’t say anything specific from back then because I wasn’t really paying attention. Now I love that stuff. I love the whole theatrical thing of it. Some people say it’s corny, I don’t know, I dig it. I like anything that has some crazy imagery. I’ve learned in my old age to really value the artistic presentation of everything. Before, I was just like, “I only want to see bands in Tshirts.” At This Is Hardcore last week, when CODE ORANGE played, they had a screen with the crazy stuff going on, that was cool, something different. Because you’re playing a fest and all these bands are kind of doing the same thing and then they came on and it was refreshing. Not saying that all the other bands weren’t great, I’m saying though that they came and it was just, “wow, okay, something to watch. This is cool.” They’re nice people too. So I mean, it was great.
Last weekend, we had a Heavy Montreal here, that big Metal fest, and I’m not a Black Metal guy personally, but WATAIN played and the imagery and the presentation was unbelievable.
That was another band that I missed, that didn’t go see but wanted to. It’s was gonna come up to that fest too with Matt from HATEBREED -I play in another band with him, which is more of a slow band. Matt was actually in All Out War for a while too.- I was thinking about coming up with him but then they flew up the night before and we had This Is Hardcore that day.
What’s the name of the band with Matt?
BELOW THE FROST. It has me, Matt, my wife who used to be in STARKWEATHER -that’s why my love of the band!- and this guy Mike who was in a band called PRIME EVIL and also played guitar in DEMOLITION HAMMER for a while. It’s like weird stuff, really slow and Doom. It’s not like any of our other bands. I would say the closest thing is to Starkweather but even that, it’s because Michelle writes all the music. It’s definitely refreshing to play that stuff because it’s different. It’s hard to get everybody’s schedule on especially with Matt because he’s always all over the place for sure but we’re hopefully going to release something soon.
I just remembered, I saw BEHEMOTH, AT THE GATES and WOLVES IN THE THRONE ROOM last November and At The Gates really impressed me. I mean, all three of the bands did but they were just so on point. I went into it not expecting anything special, I’ve seen them before, whatever but I was impressed. They were fucking great.
It’s incredible how they keep putting out amazing records too. They had that hiatus and most of these bands that come back and you go, “Yeah, the record’s alright.” but theirs come out and it may be their best stuff. It’s amazing when that happens.
NAPALM DEATH is sort of like that too, they just keep putting out bangers. *pauses* I love talking about music. You know a record that came out last year that was really good but went unnoticed was the TERRORIZER record. I thought that was a great record. I was surprised that that didn’t get more more hype. I didn’t really hear a lot of people talk about it so much. I mean, I heard it and thought it was fantastic.
Do you have any favorite artists in genres that you typically don’t listen to?
Well, I really liked the CRANBERRIES so that’s definitely one. Let’s see. I just started really be into CULT OF LUNA so that’s another one. There’s two off the top of my head.
What makes them stick out for you? Compared to other stuff that you’ve listened in that style.
Cult Of Luna is very refreshing to me, I just really liked them. The Cranberries, I’ve always liked her voice, you know? Those two definitely stand out. There’s this band that I started listening to, the DECEMBERISTS. I dug them. The 10 inch record that they put out is lying around the house. I gotta give my wife credit for that, she bought it. I just listened to it.
Do you have any unpopular music opinion like stuff that you you think is great, and you you just can’t get anyone to agree with you say stuff that I think is great.
As far as Metal goes, I have one. I just did this list for No Echo, where they wanted me to do a top five Metal records of the 80’s and I love Into The Pandemonium by CELTIC FROST. People are always like, “that’s your favorite Celtic Frost record?” I’m like, hell yeah, that’s my favorite! I’m not saying I don’t like the other stuff, I think, Into The Pandemonium, to have those songs on that record, especially when it came out in 1987, to cover Mexican radio as a Metal band, that took some guts to do that. Then to have that song, I won’t dance, I remember the first time I heard it, skipping school, and people I don’t even know were driving the car. Somebody threw that in and everybody in the car hated it but I was like, “whoa, this is fucking great.” I knew it was something a lot of people weren’t going to dig because it was definitely not typical. That record, I don’t know if people hate it, but they definitely wouldn’t say that that’s their favorite Celtic Frost record.
What band would you say as the most flawless discography? It can be a long one, can be a short one, but it needs to be perfect all around.
If it wasn’t for Cold Lake, I would say Celtic Frost because but Cold Lake is so bad that it kills it for them. Let’s see. SLAYER, I’m not into any of the newer stuff. Bands keep popping into my head and then I remember that one record, you know? And I don’t want to say a band who just put out two records or so. This is a great question and definitely one that I want to answer…I could say CARCASS if it wasn’t for Swan Song. So many bands are so close but they just have that record. I love all the KREATOR records, except for Coma Of Souls that’s a real clunker. It’s like the only one. Testament has a couple of “meh” too. I don’t know, I gotta get back to you.
Well, we’re thinking more along lines of a long discography there but is there a band that you can think of where they put out one fantastic record and then disbanded? One that you really wish they would have kept going?
Well, there’s bands that just put out a couple of records that I wish put out more like, like CONGRESS and LIAR from Belgium, but they did put out a few records. I would say ABSOLUTION. I would love to have a full length Absolution record. That seven inch was phenomenal and I would love to see where that project would have went. That pops right into my head. Then, I mean, there was a bunch of New York bands that came and went. NAUSEA only has the one full length but they have a ton of EP’s though. So Absolution is definitely one because they didn’t even lose any steam. They just stopped. It wasn’t like there was like a wall they just popped on the scene and then were gone.
My answer to this would be -we were talking about Reach The Sky before- STAND ACCUSED, that short-lived band front by Ian Larrabee.
Right, I forgot about them. They were great.
Last one, is there any up and coming bands that you’d like to give props to?
There’s a lot of a lot of them. I really like the band JESUS PIECE from Philadelphia, great band. Then there’s more established bands like GATECREEPER. Oh, you know who we played with yesterday actually? OUTER HEAVEN. They’re a great band. On the Hardcore side of things, MINDFORCE is really great.
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