For us growing up on the early to mid 90’s skate Punk craze, music discovery meant to compulsively seek every records released on Fat Wreck and Epitaph. In a world filled with copycats that we too often differentiated by the vocals, it became clear quite early that Propagandhi was another animal. Aside from their intriguing Winnipeg, Canada, origin in a sea of California bands, it was their technical prowess and their uncompromising, socially conscious lyrics that made them special. It simply cannot be overstated how formative and eye-opening their Less Talk, More Rock record was.
Their follow-up (and equally classic) record, Today’s Empire, Tomorrow’s Ashes introduced us to ex-I Spy Todd The Rod on bass, contributing decisively more aggressive lines and vocals to the mix. This turn towards a rawer, darker direction would set the tone for the consistent evolution the band would subsequently display on a very solid string of records. Never the band to rehash their material or set boundaries, they learned to embrace their love for both Punk and Metal, as reading this interview will make clear. In my mind, this all culminated into their most well-rounded record to date, 2017’s Victory Lap. As we wait patiently for the next chapter, enjoy this conversation with Todd.
Pick up Victory Lap and other Propagandhi releases and merch here.
What have you been listening to the most lately?
MAGNUM, old band from the UK. They’ve been around for, I guess, 48 years. They were kind of a Rock band that was big in the UK in the 80’s but I don’t think anywhere else. They toured the US with JUDAS PRIEST and stuff. I’d always heard of them, but I never listened to him and then I heard them one day, and I was like, “What is this?” I checked it out and that was amazing. I’ve been listening to them every day. It was just a couple of months ago but I went through all the records. I like within the last 10 years records probably the best, but they have some amazing old songs as well. If someone wants to see a cool video, they have a live version of the song Les Morts Dansant. Their performance was incredible. I’d also recommend this song called sacred Sacred Blood Divine Lies.
Is it through that video that you discovered them?
No, I was listening to something on Spotify and it came up. It sounded really unique because they’re old now but the singer used to be able to sing high like Freddie Mercury and all that. His voice still has this awesome tone, I hadn’t heard someone who sounds like this. Then I checked it out and almost all the songs are amazing.
What’s your favorite ways of discovering new music these days? Is it mainly Spotify? Or perhaps browsing records or even live, during normal times?
I guess the funnest way is live, when you’re just blown away. When I was a kid, I’d mostly not have the record and go see the band. Like SNFU and NO MEANS NO…maybe I would buy the record the week before the show but sometimes it’d be just seeing the band the first time like. Like the band from Montreal called the DOUGHBOYS. The first time I saw them in ’87, I’d never heard them before and I was talking to the bass player before the show, I was a little kid asking him like, “Are you as fast as DRI?” I didn’t know what to expect, you know, and he was super nice and he was like, “yeah, we’re faster than DRI, don’t worry.” *Haha* Then they played and they just totally blew me away. Once they started playing I understood that he was joking about DRI! *Haha*
What’s the last time that you remember discovering a band live that blew you away?
It happens lots of times because I go to see bands and the opening bands are sometimes awesome. Like, I went to see DEICIDE kind of for fun but it was the opening band IMMOLATION that blew my mind. That was a long time ago though. Most recently, I’ve seen good ones, like BLOOD INCANTATION, who were actually opening for Immolation. That was one of the last shows I saw, like a year and a half ago. Also, URIAH HEEP opening for JUDAS PRIEST in Saskatoon is one of the last shows I saw. They were awesome so I started listening to them. Going back to MAGNUM, I guess you should link that up to something off of Priest’s Firepower.
Sure! Is that your favorite Priest record?
Now you’re getting me going! *Haha* Defenders Of The Faith is my favorite but I try not to stick in the past thinking that it’s the best, but Firepower is awesome too. I like it.
We have a typical question where we ask what’s the most flawless sequence of three records in a row by an artist and a lot of people say Judas Priest, so what would your best sequence of three records from them? Or any artist you feel deserve the title I guess.
Actually, maybe The ACCÜSED. In the 80’s, they had three killer fucking records in a row, starting with More Fun Than An Open Casket Funeral. The first three VENOM records! Too bad MERCIFUL FATE never put out another one back in the 80’s. I wish I could say COC but no. Oh, SACRIFICE! Let’s see…*browsing his records collection*…The DOUGHBOYS had three really good records in a row in the 80’s. The first, second and third records, I like them all. The third one maybe is a bit of a dip but still. FAITH WARNING had three really good records in a row. The first three KREATOR records. Maybe The EXPLOITED…SEPULTURA might have three great records in a row. I can’t remember what the third would be.
Well, for me, if you say Beneath, Arise and Chaos A.D., that’s a pretty good sequence!
I was a little less into Chaos A.D. for some reason, that direction.
What’s the album that you’ve listened to the most in your life?
I would say JUDAS PRIEST, Defenders Of The Faith probably. Or possibly a KISS record? Maybe not.
Is there a band who one put out one fantastic release, either an LP, EP or even demo, before disbanding, and you just wish they would have kept going?
Well, if you don’t count MANLIFTINGBANNER’s seven inch, the first ten inch was unreal. One of the best records.
Actually you know who else, this guy GARNET ROGERS. Amazing, dark. He plays acoustic but not cheap. He’s actually truly unbelievable and professional, not like a punk kid slamming away on his electric guitar.
That’s not quite the question but YOUTH OF TODAY, We’re Not In This Alone is a standalone great record. I don’t really like the first two but We’re Not In This Alone blows my mind. Here’s a band that has one amazing record is VIO-LENCE. Maybe MEGADETH also, the only record I like a lot is Peace Sells. SACRED REICH had one truly amazing, unbelievable record. CRO-MAGS have one truly great record.
What are some of the most memorable shows that you’ve seen?
Oh, this band BEYOND POSSESSION, from Calgary. One of the greatest bands. That was my favorite show I’ve ever seen. They’re a Crossover band. That show was ’88 I think, and they played in Regina. The show never went on till midnight and it was a school night. I didn’t know what to do, if I should just go home. I’d never heard them before, so that’s actually another thing that I saw that I never heard. When they started playing, it was unreal. The bass player was incredible. I actually was talking to Katon W. De Pena from HIRAX, this old Metal band in the States. I knew that they’ve played shows with Beyond Possession, because when they played in Regina, one of the guys was wearing a Hirax shirt. So I was talking to Katon about that and he was calling the bass player of Beyond Possession the Steve Harris of Punk. I remember watching, the way that him and the drummer were playing was unlike anything I ever saw before, in their tightness and amazingness. Their songs are so fast. The singer sings so fast. You listen to him, and you’ll be like, “How the fuck is anyone singing that fast?” And it’s not Grind, it’s Crossover. It’s not massively fast, it’s just the singing’s so fast.
I would also say SNFU in ’88 and again, in maybe 2006 when they returned. And NO MEANS NO on the The Day Everything Became Nothing tour.
Is there any bands that you never got the chance to see but you really wish that you would have seen?
Most bands I like, I would have liked to see in their peak. Being from Regina, every band I wanted to see never ever showed up.
SACRIFICE with RAZOR, that was one show in Regina though and one of my favorites. None of the Thrash bands we liked came to Regina, never ever ever. Not even VOIVOD. Back then, no one crossed Canada and played Regina. So Sacrifice and Razor was to see real Thrash bands. I was so excited.
If you wanted to drive to a show to see a good lineup, what was the closest town?
Winnipeg, but I was too young. I did start driving to Winnipeg later, to see like COFFIN BREAK. They’re a pretty cool band from Seattle. They would get more tours, but it still wouldn’t be all the things you want to see are coming, you know what I mean? It’s kind of a downer of being in Regina. Oh, I saw an old GOVERNMENT ISSUE show that I really loved and then a little later, LOS CRUDOS from Chicago. That was one of my favorites shows, the first time I saw them.
I guess this created somewhat of a stronger feel for the local scene, right? What was the big local band back then in Regina?
To me, the one I liked the best was called UNLAWFUL ASSEMBLY. If you go to their song Nosferatu on YouTube, you can actually see me in the video. It was filmed in like ’88 and there’s a kid going off the stage a bunch of times in a red hoodie and that’s me. To me, they were as good as any Thrash band. Or maybe more of a Thrash / Death Metal mix. Right when Death Metal was starting so they were kind of both but they were amazing.
Was it more of a Metal scene back then?
No, it was both. There wasn’t enough bands so you’d be into both. That’s kind of what I miss. Now, it’s like, I like Metal or I like Punk. When I got into Punk, and I was talking to Chris (note: Propagandhi’s guitarist/vocalist) about this, I think I was wrong about what Punk even was because every Punk band that I knew was a Crossover band. BEYOND POSSESSION, SNFU, BAD BRAINS, they were all fast, all Metal-y. The ACCÜSED, POISON IDEA, even DAYGLO ABORTION, everything was Metal Punk. I thought Punk was Metal Punk, except for a few bands like the Doughboys and ALL, they were kind of different. It would almost sound wrong when people would play me The RAMONES or SEX PISTOLS; I was just like, “okay, they’re some kind of old Punk that whatever, I don’t care about” It didn’t mean anything to me. So I think I was wrong and in Propagandhi, we’ve basically carried on that tradition of what we like: Metal Punk. We’re playing it like the way that we thought initially. Obviously, we’re trying to progress and not play the same rehash but, the attitudes are the same, we’re into Metal and Punk, this kind of hybrid. I can only speak for myself but, personally, I’ve never really veered off that idea.
If we go all the way back, do you remember the first time music had an impact on you?
Yeah, I remember clearly actually. My mom had a whole shitload of records and there was one record with a Russian cavalry coming over this hill, like one of those old Russian paintings. I remember saying to my mom, “I love this, what is it?” and so she put it on and I was no taller than the back of a couch because I remember standing on a couch holding on to the back cushion. It was a song called The Sabre Dance, this crazy fast Russian song. It was the most exciting, energetic song I’d ever heard in my life. It’s got that the same kind of galloping feel that IRON MAIDEN developed later. I just remember that song blowing my mind, like “I need to hear this song again.” Then, just the picture of the horses coming over the hill in this big battle. There was a feeling of excitement in that song and nothing really topped it for a while. I would later listen to maybe BILLY JOEL and stuff like that, trying to get that feeling because it was the most rockin’ thing I could find. Then it wasn’t until my neighbor Chris, who’s dad had KISS records. As soon as I heard Kiss, I was sold. It was the same feeling as of the Sabre Dance but coming from a Rock band, with the guitars and painted faces. It was that overwhelming sound of Kiss Alive 1 that just blew my mind, I couldn’t believe it. Then I was 100% dedicated to Kiss, I thought nothing could be better and then when I heard PRIEST, I was like, “holy shit!”
What were your next few milestones, in terms of discovery?
I guess then VENOM is the next huge “this is crazy.” It was totally different. I liked MÖTLEY CRÜE and stuff but they’re basically a mix between Kiss and Priest, but Venom was so different. Then that moved into Thrash, when SLAYER and METALLICA started coming out. VOIVOD! They’re another one with three good records in a row. Like 20 in a row! *Haha* Then, when I started hearing DEAD KENNEDYS and DAYGLO and stuff like that. I remember being at a DEATH SENTENCE show, from Vancouver, and they were all like, Punk Punk you know? But actually kind of a more Punk Glam mixture, they weren’t like UK Punks, they were…I don’t know, maybe drug addict Punk scene? It really felt awesome to me. Same with the EXPLOITED, it was kind of Metal but stripped down to this raw form. Same with Dayglo and Dead Kennedys, it was starting to be more meaningful.
Then I heard another completely mind blowing record with COC Animosity. I had never heard anything so raw and crazy in my life. Then COC Technocracy blew my head off. But the next record was 100% disappointing.
Through it all, what place did lyrics had for you in discovering new music? To this day, what place do lyrics hold in your appreciation? Can you deal with sub-part lyrics or it has to be meaningful?
Yeah, I think if you compare JUDAS PRIEST’s Firepower to a couple records ago, I think what changed is the urgency in the lyrics. The lyrics are way more meaningful and therefore the record hits everyone way harder. Whereas the records before were a little more fantasy oriented. I could feel urgency and that’s what’s necessary for me. Like the songs I recommended by MAGNUM, both those songs, the lyrics are what makes it powerful. Like Les Morts Dansant, it’s the lyrics that make it extra special. The song’s about soldiers being caught in a barbed wire fence, getting shot to pieces, and it looks like they’re dancing. The dance of death or whatever. I think it’s lyrics like that, that pushes it over the edge. You just feel this deepness coming from people, that connects with you. It could be anything, it could be listening to TLC on the radio, whether the lyrics are good or bad will push it way beyond over the edge. Even if you don’t think much of it, or it’s some song sung by this young woman about like, Peter Pan or whatever, one of those Justin Bieber type songs, but you can tell what she was feeling this minute moment. It’s so vastly different than if some songwriter just came up with these lyrics thinking, this young woman’s gonna sing this and I’ll write some corn for her.
Who would be your favorite lyricist ever?
I’d say Chi Pig from SNFU for sure. When he’s singing deep, like One Legged Bridge Jumper and stuff like that, I find it so immensely meaningful. And I would say Jello Biafra was great…he’s still good but he kind of keeps doing the same thing over and over now, putting himselves in someone’s character…”I am inspector…” or whatever… But at some point, I thought he was the best. Yeah, lyrics mean so much, you look at SACRIFICE lyrics, they’re awesome. Actually, all bands that are successful, like, really successful, it’s the lyrics I would say. Old COC, Technocracy that’s one of the best lyrics on that record. The lyrics on CIRCLE JERKS’ VI are really good, but I don’t know if I can really say they are the best. But if you look at CELTIC FROST, listen to Circle Of The Tyrants and listen to the lyrics. It’s fucking amazing. “The battle is over and the sand’s drunken the blood. All that there remains is the bitterness of delusion” As opposed to you know, “666, blah blah blah” *Haha* Even as I say that, the lyrics on the first DEICIDE record, they’re so awesome! There’s so much conviction behind the idiocy. He was so into Satan that he burnt it into his forehead, you know? When I’m listening, I can be like, “I fucking love this negative fucking energy right now.” Later on, once it becomes this schtick, “kill the christians” you know, okay, whatever.
I’ll say one more best lyricist is Sam McPheeters from BORN AGAINST. Those lyrics truly moved me. There’s that line, it’s in my head all the time, it says “You’re not the victim, as shocking as it may seem.” You know, it’s the same as when you see something about residential schools and people will spin it, “Oh, they want to cancel Canada Day, I’m hurt. How could you offend me like that?” It’s that idea, you’re not the victim! As shocking as it may seem to you. I find that line is so amazing.
And I’ll mention him again because, I don’t think anything moves me as much as his songs, this guy GARNET ROGERS. I don’t really listen to much acoustic music at all, I almost all just listen to heavy music, but this guy…I think he’s went through a lot of hardship in his life, lots of people dying and stuff, and he expresses it so well. If you do want to be sad, go listen to him and you’ll just sit there, like, “okay, now I’m sad.” *Haha*
Is there any classic or universally acclaimed artists that you missed out on when they first came out and discovered way later? A “Where have you been all my life” type of feeling.
I guess I could say MAGNUM! I don’t know if they’re universally acclaimed, but they’re UK acclaimed, just not Canadian acclaimed. Every now and then, I’ll get into something that I missed out on a little bit. I hated ALICE COOPER when I was a little kid because, I had this book of rock stars and I think it was when Alice Cooper was really on heroin. Something about him, his picture where he looked so sickly to me. To my childhood mind, I wouldn’t say it scared me but it kind of repulsed something in me. As a little kid, I did not understanding, his makeup all dripping and he’s with this snake and he had cold sores on his face. I hated Alice Cooper but a little older, I has like, “Fuck, I love this.”
Budgie was a good band I missed. Maybe THIN LIZZY was something I missed. CATATONIA is one of my favorite bands. I saw them once and thought they were a good band and never listen to them again. Then I got into them later.
Do you have any unpopular music opinion that you’d like to defend? Something that you truly love, but can hardly find anyone to agree with you?
Not that I can think of. I don’t mind TLC when I hear them, which is probably why I mentioned them before, but don’t have a CD or anything. I don’t really like Pop music…when I hear the BEATLES, it sounds terrible to me. I’ll appreciate some like, PRINCE, but I could name anything, like DAVID BOWIE, TRAVELING WILBURYS, probably not. Maybe JOHNNY CASH I like. My dad was super into it. Or WILLIE NELSON, sometimes I play On The Road Again.
So nothing that’s off limit to play in the van, where everyone’s going to complain?
Oh, fuck. Someone will complain about no matter what you play! *Haha* We don’t even listen to music. I remember our roadie guy, Barney, was crying because Chris was listening to AC/DC one time!
You know what, one popular thing that I listen to is SIA. She has a couple songs that really touch me. I’ve made this playlist that I listen all the time. There’s this Opera singer ANDREA BOCELLI, I listen to him a little bit.
What’s the band that you’ve toured with that impressed you the most? The one that you had to watch their set, night after night?
I really enjoyed watching PROTEST THE HERO. There’s a lot though. I thought RVIVR was awesome. But yeah, Protest The Hero could get quite crazy and just the singer’s voice is so good. I try not to take for granted what it takes to achieve some things, so I would say them probably.
In closing, is there any up and coming bands that you’d like to recommend?
Maybe this band AGASSIZ.
Anything that we haven’t covered that deserve people’s attention?
Oh, here’s an awesome song, CRUMBSUCKERS Trapped. One thing that I’ve listened to, that song What a feeling off of Flashdance. I like that song Single Ladies by BEYONCE. These are just single songs. Oh. Check out this song Palea by DOBET GNAHORE, that’s one of my favorite songs in the world, I think.
Final thoughts? Anything you’d like to promote?
We’re writing new material. We have a file with 20 songs going on. Chris sent me 10 or 12, at some point. Now, the hard part is to put lyrics on them. I find it’s the absolute hardest part. It’s not too hard to riff, but to put them together into something that people actual wanna hear is not easy, for me anyway. Typically, if I write the song, I write the lyrics. Same with Chris. You usually make the riff with some sort of vocals in mind already. But it’s gonna be good, I can tell. I like what’s happened. It will be different again. Both me and Chris have been working like crazy playing guitar, and trying to get better at singing.
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